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Facility Engineer Question
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marvin.palmer
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Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 21
Location: Colorado Springs, Co

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2012 2:53 pm    Post subject: Facility Engineer Question Reply with quote

Jumping onboard with this new system. Now I just need to find the data to help build the file!
Where can you find the MSA to add MASW and Suppression?
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Marvin Palmer
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Last edited by marvin.palmer on Mon Jan 16, 2012 4:08 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Andrew Wolcott
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2012 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you have a copy of your facility Minimum Vector Altitude (MVA) map?

This can be used to develop your MSAW processing regions.

MVA maps provide 1,000' clearance from terrain and obstacles in low lying areas, and 2,000' clearance from terrain and obstacles in mountainous regions, such as KSLC and KDEN.

In the real world, MSAW general terrain/obstacle processing only provides a 500' clearance, however this is adaptable. What I have decided to do is use our MVA Map. I still have some testing to accomplish, but the idea is to use the MVA numbers and areas, minus either 500' or 1,000', depending on where vSTARS sets off the LA alert. This is where I need to accomplish testing.

The MSAW suppression zones will usually be made along the final approach courses, so as to allow for aircraft that are on their final approach within 3-5 miles of the airport.

If you have your facility MVA map, and can send it to me, or at least point me to the sector file that has the MVA map in it, I can easily convert the areas to the appropriate decimal for lat/long so you can enter them into vSTARS.

You would be the one to decide what altitude to use, and you would also be the one to figure out your MSAW suppression zones.
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Andrew Wolcott
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marvin.palmer
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Joined: 16 Jan 2012
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Location: Colorado Springs, Co

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2012 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Andrew Wolcott wrote:
Do you have a copy of your facility Minimum Vector Altitude (MVA) map?

This can be used to develop your MSAW processing regions.


I do have an MVA of the area, I know that the MSA's are what you pointed out typically higher than MVAs.
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Marvin Palmer
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Andrew Wolcott
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2012 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

marvin.palmer wrote:
Andrew Wolcott wrote:
Do you have a copy of your facility Minimum Vector Altitude (MVA) map?

This can be used to develop your MSAW processing regions.


I do have an MVA of the area, I know that the MSA's are what you pointed out typically higher than MVAs.


I just looked at the MVA in your sector file. A11 is missing some lines.



Fairbanks looks good. I could convert that one, but your A11 is gonna need to be fixed.
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marvin.palmer
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2012 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I will PM you the A11 ".dat" file
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Marvin Palmer
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Andrew Wolcott
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2012 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RGR. I'll get that done for ya.

Or you can email it to me.

datm@minniecenter.org
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Andrew Wolcott
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marvin.palmer
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2012 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

email sent with files, let me know if you got them...I got e-mailed failed repsonses.
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Marvin Palmer
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Andrew Wolcott
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2012 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

marvin.palmer wrote:
email sent with files, let me know if you got them...I got e-mailed failed repsonses.


Not sure why it would have kicked back. I replied to your test email with the FAI data.
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Andrew Wolcott
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mlovetto
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:38 pm    Post subject: frustrating Reply with quote

I cannot decipher the MVA map coordinates......... sigh
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marvin.palmer
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:27 pm    Post subject: Re: frustrating Reply with quote

mlovetto wrote:
I cannot decipher the MVA map coordinates......... sigh


No need to, unless you are trying to dress it up....what are you trying to do?
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Marvin Palmer
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mlovetto
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm just trying to take the data in the MVA section... it's all lat/long in deg min sec format and find the zones for the MVAs so I can add the coordinates into vSTARS...


**** MVA section in the .sct2 file
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marvin.palmer
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Andrew helped if on this part...I'd ask if has time to convert for you
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Marvin Palmer
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dhawton
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Joined: 05 Apr 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To convert from degree/minute/second format to decimal degree format used by VSTARS, just google it. Can use http://transition.fcc.gov/mb/audio/bickel/DDDMMSS-decimal.html
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Daniel Hawton
RW: KNPA Tower/Radar Controller/OJTI
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marvin.palmer
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Works great for 5-10 lines to convert.....

Not when you are dealing with over 500 lines (overexaggerating for effect)
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Marvin Palmer
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Xalorplex
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My method of converting the MVAs was a little hack and chop, but I think it did the job for my purposes:

1) I took a printscreen of the MVA along with a video map of a SID/STAR which had a few known coordinates on it.
2) I brought the graphic into a drafting program (DraftSight is free but I think you have to sign up with them), traced over the lines, and then used a DXF to SCT program which I found in the VRC forums to export the file. It's not 100% accurate, but it gives me the region boundaries plus or minus a mile or two.
3) The DXF to SCT converter program exports a couple of different .sct files and I added the "GEO" section to our own .sct2 file and then converted it to a video map using the application that comes with vSTARS
4) I used a jEdit (handy text editing program) macro to clean up the video map file.
5) Then it's just a matter of copy and pasting the coords from the cleaned up file and into vSTARS.

I'm sure Andrew has a cleaner method (and I'd appreciate it if he shared his method as well so I can do up the other airports in our ARTCC Smile), but this worked for me and I doubt Andrew wants to convert every MVA out there!
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